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Friday, November 30, 2007

Comments

GreenEyedLilo

Why would a bisexual woman married to a lesbian still call herself bisexual? If you really want to know, rather than fill in what you think are the answers yourself:

*Because I honor the two men I have loved in the past. Just because our relationships depreciated like new cars becoming old doesn't mean they were bad men or bad relatinoships.

*Because I honor and own my true fantasies and feelings. I don't look at male race car drivers and UPS men like a lesbian. I look at them like a bisexual woman--I get attracted to them. I won't do anything, but I get attracted. It's like the way my crush on Sinead O'Connor (who is Irish) doesn't invalidate my love for my Russian woman--nobody tells her she's going to have to prepare for the day I leave her for an Irish person. But my wife's warned about how I'll leave her for a man all the time, when I have no intention of leaving, EVER.

*Because I honor my wife and my other relationships. I want to deal with the ones I love truthfully. I want them to know my past, present, and future. I want them to be honest with me, and I can't expect that if I'm not honest.

*Finally, because I honor myself. I know who and what I am. I didn't stop being 50/50 bisexual and identifying as such for my boyfriends, and I won't for my wife, either. It doesn't work like that. I've been this way since I was *little*, and frankly, I don't see much wrong with it. The only thing wrong with it is the way so many straight and lesbian people react to it.

Truthiz

@Truelife: Good question!

That's right up there with the question as to WHY do most "bisexuals" and "bi-curious" women have a tendency to hook-up with REAL lesbians rather than other bisexuals?!

truelife

I have a question for Tenise and all other bisexual women who are engaged to or married to lesbians. If you are serious about spending the rest of your life with one woman in a monogamous relationship, why do you identify as bisexual? Wouldn't it make you a lesbian if you are only going to have sex with one woman for the rest of your life?

Many lesbians have been with men in the past -- prior to coming out of the closet and becoming comfortable with their sexuality. But once you realize that you want to get married an start a family with another woman, doesn't that make you a lesbian?

Why must you hold on to the identity of bisexual or bicurious after you have committed your life to a lesbian relationship?

Tenise

As a Black bisexual woman who is engaged to my Black lesbian partner of four years, I find some of these comments about bisexual women disturbing.

I think that everyone is confusing women who are users pretending to be bisexual with actual bisexual women. I think that the Black GLBTI community needs to be careful that we don't perpetuate stereotypes about bisexuals based upon anecdotal evidence.

Just because some of the women here haven't met honest, monogamous, real bisexual women, doesn't mean that they don't exist. That stereotype could easily be used against Black lesbian women too.

VERB

Omi Femi, you put it down. Great post!

JustMe

I've been following this post for a few days and I find it very interesting. But I don't think it has anything to do with labels or whatever these women like to classify themselves as... I am so tired of these women bisexual/bicurious/doing whatever-makes-them-feel-good that are using women to get through a rough spot in their lives. I see it all the time.. I have a friend that has admitted that she only dates women when she needs an emotional connection and if she finds a man that can do that her girlfriend of over a year is in the wind.

Most of the blame is on these using ass women and thats why many Lesbians choose not to date bisexuals or women that have had relationships with men recently. Most of my friends only go for "Gold Star" Lesbians because they feel like atleast that way they know the women have the intention of a relationship with you because you are a woman.

Perps are giving a bad rep to Bisexuals that really want relationships and Lesbians that like this trend because it puts notches on their "turning girls out" belt..thats another shame.

This is the way girls act in high school..its just really sad that some people never grow up :(

Thanks for the topic Jasmyne..

LesB

Couldn't agree with you more. The definition of lesbian used to be so easy. A woman who is attracted to, has sex with (when she can), and wants to be with a woman. Is this so hard for other people to get? Bi-sexuals are not lesbians and should have no say in lesbian issues or lesbian life. They are just women-hurting-women. And straight women using lesbians to hurt men are just as bad. Or worse. And a dime a dozen. So hard to find a real lesbian these days. So many don't want to be labeled. Well, I'm proud of the label and always have been.

NattyFemme07

I've read a few of the comments on here and I'm sorry, but I think the whole "fluid sexuality" concept is bunk. This is NOT about fluid sexuality - this is about fraud.

And as for the topic at hand, I can only say this: Weak minded people do weak minded things. Weak women are desparate and looking for anybody to pay the bills/watch the kids/pick them up, etc. I'm more angry that
a) We have a plethora of these weak minded black women
and
b) We have an equal plethora of doms willing to walk right into the trap. My gf is a good example: We're currently dealing with the drama of her ex - who was pregnant when she met her. Now you tell me how the hell that works....

Mark

As a gay man, I found this to be interesting, and, think that women, gay or straight, especially the younger ones don't have the "labels" attached to their sexuality and go with the flow, which to me is good, as long as they are up front if entering a relationship.

The labels with gay men require a dictionary to figure out who is who and what's going on.

mistic

Hi, I really enjoyed your article and the resulting comments because it spoke directly to a fear of mine. Being fluid in my sexuality, my main concern is for women like me who are still sorting out their feelings. In looking deep within myself, I have many similar questions and concerns about being bisexual:
Is it just about the sex? (no)
Can I love another woman the same way I could love a man? (yes)
Am I committed to LGBT causes? (yes, LGBT of color in particular)
Can I be in a relationship? (yes)
Can I be in a long term relationship and start a family with another woman? (no, not mentally there yet).

So therein lies my flaw...I cannot imagine a future domestic partnership with another woman. Does that make me a perpetrator? I think not, because what I feel makes me bisexual is my capacity to love women and men with the same (or distinct)passion. I just haven't overcome my social conditioning that instills in me the ultimate desire to "find a man", get married, and have children.

My point is, what really defines a true bisexual--is it someone who fits squarely in the middle? Where is the room for fluidity, introspection and self-discovery? While I truly am appalled by the actions of other women who were just "testing the waters" only to go back to men, I just wish it wouldn't stigmatize permanently those who are simply coming into their own after years of suppressing and denying their feelings for other women, and are committed to all aspects of what it means to be LGBTQ.

truelife

As a lesbian, the last thing I want to do is be discriminatory towards a particular group of people. However, its hard for me not to look down on bisexual women in light of all the suffering they have inflicted upon lesbians.

Since I've been out of the closet, I have only been exposed to one type of bisexual woman -- the kind who becomes involved with a woman with NO intention of seriously being with her. In some cases, I have seen these types of scenarios become violent. One of my lesbian friends was actually physically assaulted by a man while she was involved with dishonest bisexual woman who was playing her and a man at the same time.

I know that bisexuals are theoretically supposed to be monogamous and committed, but I have never seen this in real life. Where are these sincere bisexuals? I'm beginning to believe they don't exist in real life.

Truthiz

Probably the most important thing I always try to do when engaging in any substantive discussion is get an Understanding of that issue_ especially when it’s a "sensitive" issue concerning how it might relate to my life, the lives of others and the world I live in.

I have to say that I’m enjoying the general flow of this discussion thus far!

Now_I won’t even pretend to know what goes on in the men’s community. I’ll leave that to the guys.

But my understanding of the central theme of this topic is that we’ve got too many “Perpetrators” running loose in the Black lesbian community. And with respect to “stereotyping”…

I see “Stereotyping” and “Perpetrating” as two separate issues, each with merit_but separate issues, nevertheless.

Stereotyping has to do with having a “general mental image of a group or class of people that is usually oversimplified.”

Whereas, perpetrating has to do with “performing an ACT, usually with a Negative connotation”

Hence the phrases “Everything that shines ain’t gold.” _ and_ “Just because she slept with you doesn't make her gay."

I agree with whoever stated that some Studs/Butches/ Dom Aggs go for “perpetrators”. They're cool with it and in those cases there's No harm, No foul.

I also agree with whoever expressed that Real lesbians can usually “smell” a perpetrator from a mile away. But therein lies MY biggest problem with perpetrators…Not all lesbians possess that kind of insight or discernment!

Unfortunately, they don’t “smell” a thing until it’s much too late..and by then they’ve already invested their time, their money and, most importantly, their hearts in those relationships, believing they had the “real” thing only to discover they were Played by those parasites!

Jeremiah

As a black gay man I found this article very intriguing. I don't think there is such a phenomenon going on in the gay community. Actually, it's the opposite; that is, gay men claiming to be DL/bi-sexual when they know good and damn well they're gay!!!

Steve

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Lesbian Movie Guide

Hmmm...
The need to place people in neat little categories strikes again!
The definition's of lesbian, bisexual, femme, butch etc are so rigid and restricting.

It is time to realize that we are a fluid collection of people. There is a whole spectrum of different types of women that love women.

We cannot apply rigid rules to how we think other lesbian women should behave based on our own individual beliefs.

I live for the day when a woman can love another woman in her own special way without her every move being analyzed to see if she fits into certain misguided stereotypes.

We complain about mainstream media stereotyping us all the time but me thinks we are the worst offenders

Johanna

Thank you Jasmyne. At last a lesbian woman that address this so often happening problem with this fake lesbian. a very good discussion.
I live in Germany, so sorry for my bad english.
I can only say, I had the sad experience to fall in love with this womankind. The crazy think is that she realy wanted to have partnership a real relationship. Well, she had a very own picture of what should be the real think.
She was 24 at that time, a single parent of a 4 years old boy and a turkish moslem. This last thing dyed very much the way she acted.
We started a long-distance relationship because she lived in another city....so we saw eachother every 2 weeks.
I broke up after 5 months.
We must have had sex only 4 times or something (she always said to me, she fell not pretty, she doesn`t feel confortable with her body a.s.o.)
1 week after I broke up I asked her what the real reason was she had so much problems with sleeping with me (I wanted to hear it from her own mouth)
she answered she was scared of doing it. She wispered in the phone.
In other words, she didn`t wanted to.
OK, that`s it. thanks.
Straihgt woman somehow always believe they are suddenly in love with me. And I did this mistake 2 times.
Well that`s a past time now.
I learned my lessons.
best wishes,
Johanna

Angel

As for the club scene, maybe those women just enjoyed treating him like a piece of meat and being roudy. I would consider something like that more out of fun than seriousness, though I must say that I find it odd for a lesbian club.

Regardless of sexuality, I think that the women you speak of are just users - they have no real attachment to women - and probably most of the men - that they get together with. These women will use studs just as they will use men - if not for their money, then for their simple companionship, attention, and to distract themselves from the ugly emptiness inside. Flakes abound and they are indiscriminate in who they will use and abuse.

As for the studs who get with them - well, aren't most of them just using these femmes back, aren't they users too? They want to brag, they want the eye candy, etc. so they're no more emotionally involved than the femme is. Just because the straight woman is straight, I don't think that means that she's necessarily using the stud more than the stud's using her.

As far as I'm concerned let these leaches stick to each other and leave the rest of us out of it; the rest of us who have self-esteem, half-a-brain, and want something real in this life. We can spot these phonies a mile away anyway and know to avoid them. While what they do may give some of us a bad rap and hurt the community, I think everyone knows that what some people do is not a reflection on the whole and every community has their bad seeds.

Toni

The Black LGBT community does have its mysteries. Of course one mystery is your question regarding non-lesbians dating lesbians. Folks have always involved themselves with others be it same sex or opposite sex relationships out of convenience and/or profit. How many times have we seen straight women marry men (straight or gay) because of the "lifestyle" that the man can offer them? Straight women now realize that certain "studs" are more than willing to provide them with the "lifestyle" that they want..so they make themselves available to those "studs". It seems to me that certain "studs" who involve themselves with straight women do so for pretty much the same reasons as a straight man might...the woman is attractive, eye-candy and a notch in the bedpost or belt for them. The game that goes on between these straight women and "studs" is perilous, dishonest and emotionally damaging to the person who does actually care for the other person. If a "stud" is more interested in sleeping around, having eye-candy, getting props from like-minded "studs", etc. more so than actually finding and being involved with a woymn who will build and sustain a healthy emotional life with her, then that "stud" is ultimately the one responsible for her own demise with these fake lesbians/straight women.

Truthiz

Tonda asked:

"I think the other side of the discussion is what makes some butch women so eager to play that role?"

Now here's where I believe the issue of "low self-esteem" is a plausible explanation!

joy

wow--I get ya girl--this is a subject that offends these perps.I've been a lesbian my entire life and I don't mind bi girls either but I just had an experience haha with new Yorker--filrted,she bought me stuff and talked for hours on end and this went on for months.I knew she had been with a woman previously and had issues of accepting herself but her actions were only directed towards girls!! Never guys.Only went to lesbian bars--had studs for friends--and once the sex happened between us--she told me ''she had too many feeling of guilt'' and I mean within days. So, that is my question to you girls--why do you get involved with studs--lead us on then feel guilty? why go to lesbian bars? if you never picture yourself with women only married to a man. I say this--you expect the stud not to get irritated--WE are supposed to accaept YOU BUT YOU DON'T WANT THE CONCEQUENCES OF YOUR ACTIONS IN THE END. hell no i don't want to be your friend--something misleading about the whole saga of these ''perps''

Tonda

This is nothing new and has been a pervasive trend in the Black Lesbian community as long as I can remember. I commend you for putting it out there for discussion. I came out in the 70's and have witnessed many a sistah snuggled up to butch women who will step in and play daddy to their kids, pay rent, get hair and nails done, etc., only to find them gone as soon as the first brother doing not half as much shows up on the scene. I think the other side of the discussion is what makes some butch women so eager to play that role?

Truthiz

@Tracy:

A "pillow princess" tends to be "fem" and is only interested in being "pleasured", if you will...meaning, she has little-to-NO interest in "pleasuring" her partner, at least not in performing a certain "oral" activity.

But in all honesty, there are more than a few Studs/Dom Aggs who are fine with having that "understanding".

Sandy

Ms. Cannick, you are a Young and wise women. I have thought about this myself. I was almost got caught up with a woman who was not interested in any of the issues facing the black lesbian community. She never invited me to her apartment, "privacy issues". She wanted sex at my apartment. Which her HUSBAND was not providing.
Additionally, I have a friend who went BANKRUPT sporting her "eye candy" around and buying her everything that she wanted. The woman is now MARRIED TO A MAN.
I have no problem with Bi-sexuals, to each his own. Just be honest about your intentions and limitations.

Sandy

Ms. Cannick, you are a young and wise women. I have thought about this myself. I was almost got caught up with a woman who was not interested in any of the issues facing the black lesbian community. She never invited me to her apartment, "privacy issues". She wanted sex at my apartment. Which her HUSBAND was not providing.
Additionally, I have a friend who went BANKRUPT sporting her "eye candy" around and buying her everything that she wanted. The woman is now MARRIED TO A MAN.
I have no problem with Bi-sexuals, to each his own. Just be honest about your intentions and limitations.

Omi Femi

I am a bisexual woman who is proud of my sexual orientation. I have acknowledged and loved the truth of who I am for 15 years. Never a fake, confused and/or suffered from low self-esteem. Never dated brothas and sistas at the same time. And I have a loving sista as my partner for 5 years strong.

That being said, I have not witnessed the scenarios Jasmyne has brought to light. I have seen women fall in love with other women simply because of the soul connection. It had nothing to do with "man woes". And the women I am thinking of (all in their 30s and 40s) are bisexual and happily partnered with other bisexual or lesbian women.

However, in New York I have also noticed some women who carried the bisexual label did not wish to be in relationships with women. We were only good enough to have sex with. In fact, in their minds, you were not a "real" bisexual woman unless you preferred to ultimately be in a long term relationship with a man. I found this puzzling and disrespectful. I was considered a lesbian by them simply because I proudly stated that I could be in a monogamous relationship with a WOMAN or a man - not both at the same tme.

I support the opinion that sexuality is on a continuum. If the "curious" want to have sex with other women for a good time, that's on them. People have the right to explore. BUT, it is unfortunate that some of these sistas are trying on "something new" out of their frustration or boredom. They fail to realize whatever frustration they have in relationships will follow them no matter who they date or have sex with.

To my sistas who are frustrated with this all I can say is this: I learned very quickly that if I was not worthy to connect with outside of the bedroom, you were not a sista worthy my time. I think that is the real issue.

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