Alert: Homophobic Black Pastors Gathering in Los Angeles

Anytime there’s a gathering of more than one mega church Black pastor in the same place at the same, I get worried.  For starters, they hardly like to be together at one time in the first place.  Not enough room to fit all of that ego in.  Secondly, depending on what tithes have been looking like in the past couple weeks, you can bet a sure way to fire up the crowd and raise more money is to do it off of the back of lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender people.  For some reason, that always opens up wallets.

This year's Los Angeles celebration of the Azusa Street 2006 Centennial Celebration is being held at mega church pastor Bishop Charles Blake’s West Angelus Cathedral bringing together the who’s who in Black mega church pastors. 

From Los Angeles there will be the infamous Bishop Noel Jones of City of Refuge and Faithful Central’s Bishop Kenneth C. Ulmer.

From the Southwest comes Bishop T.D. Jakes.

You will remember from the Outing Black Pastor’s Campaign last year done in conjunction with my colleague Keith Boykin that Jakes has his own political involvement with the Republican Party and with President George Bush. In fact, when black America was outraged about the Administration's handling of the Hurricane Katrina crisis, George Bush turned to one black man to bail him out and shore up his damaged reputation. That man was T.D. Jakes, who was all too willing to give the President the political cover he needed.

But Jakes is even more conservative than Bush. Unlike Bush, who has hired gays and lesbians in the federal government, Jakes has called homosexuality a "brokenness" and said he would not hire a sexually active gay person.

Jakes has endorsed the so-called Truth for Youth campaign, which is distributing specially-made anti-gay Bibles to high school students all across the country.

"To date, I have not seen scriptural authority that allows me to stand on behalf of God and say I now pronounce you husband and husband, and wife and wife," Jakes told USA Today last month. "This is an issue the government is undecided about. The Bible is not," he said. But if Jakes still believes in the separation of church and state, it's not clear from his political activity. In fact, Jakes publicly endorsed the anti-gay Federal Marriage Amendment, which would have been the first amendment to the U.S. Constitution to legalize discrimination against a group of citizens.

From the South comes Bishop Paul Morton.

Bishop Morton of the Full Gospel Baptist Church, first came under our radar when he attended a 24-Hour Summit to Protect Marriage, sponsored by the Traditional Values Coalition, a group led by Lou Sheldon, a white, Republican, Christian evangelical, which is problematic in itself if you know of Lou Sheldon’s background and history. He then raised an eyebrow when he attended the Republican National Convention.

He later organized a press conference of Black pastors calling on the Congressional Black Caucus to support a constitutional amendment defending marriage and banning civil unions.

He and the pastors were denied a meeting with key members of the Congressional Black Caucus. And, after a press conference, two members of the Caucus showed up to try to silence any further comments by the pastors, according to Family News in Focus. One of those Caucus members was Congresswoman Carolyn Kilpatrick from Michigan. According to Kilpatrick: “I am opposed to a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage clearly because I do not support opening up the Constitution for such an amendment at this time or for any other thing at this time.”

Bishop Paul Morton refused to be silenced by Kilpatrick.

“We must have this federal amendment to make sure that marriage is kept sacred. It’s not about a hate thing. This is not a Republican thing, this is not a Democrat thing, this is what God says.”

According to Bishop Morton, "Marriage is a legal and moral institution that is deeply rooted in the fabric of our community. It is the joining together of two families represented by a groom/man and bride/woman to create a new family as an open statement to family, community and children of the next generation. This is our position … because it's GOD's position."

And what would service be without the music… bring in Vickie Winans, Mom and Pop Winans, and Smokie Norful.

The new West Angelus Cathedral is located at 3600 Crenshaw Boulevard in the heart of Los Angeles. 

If I planned to be town, I would attend just for the chance to give them a piece of my mind.

Activities with these pastors are scheduled Wednesday, April 26 through Friday, April 28.  After that you know everyone will be making their way home so that they can collect dues on Sunday from their own parishioners.

If you’re in Los Angeles, here’s a perfect opportunity to take a stand.

Comments

[Arthur Bright]

Folk, don't be silly! I just went through your opinions and i wish to say one or two tings:
There is no point in feeling at peace if GOD is not the one putting that peace in you. Why should you do what GOD forbeits (same sex union)? Do you really believe that GODis just going to weave a hand at this and let you walk into HIS HOLY PRESENCE when you leave this planet? Living HOLY is worth the sacrifice.... Instead of criticising others I suggest that we join hands in prayer and GOD will help us appreciate each other (and not want to have sex)... Anyway it is just my opinion, and it it 2 years late cuz I am in AFRICA.
I wish GOD would bless you as HE does to Bishop Jones.

[Amy Gray]

No matter how you try to seperate church and state it can never be seperate. Our government was founded on biblical principals by men of faith. Point blank you can't take God out of In God We Trust when it fits your political agenda or social/political group. God made Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve. God hates the sin not just homosexuality. You can't make it right or try and make christians accept your or any other sin. Sin can never be justified. It's not a matter for man to judge so no matter who agrees with you or makes you to feel your issues are ok. God is the final and absolute judge He dosen't not and will not change his word.

[Wayne]

This is amazing to say the least. All these men: Ulmer, Morton, Blake, Jakes, and N. Jones ar all "Closet Sissies!" There is absolutely NO QUESTION ABOUT THIS! Also, your song about Homosexuality is just plain STUPID!

[daniel]

i like how black mega churches can accept the membership of unwed mothers, pot heads and ex-cons but suddenly if you're gay you don't deserve the love of the church. if you are a gang member you can be part of a subsidized youth group to drop out but if gays want to marry then they rally for a federal amendment. this comes to show the leopards of the religious right can change their spots.

[Michelle]

I am a member of The City of Refuge, Bishop Noel Jones church and the alligations posted here that he is gay are POPPYCOCK!

He is a dynamic, well educated, compassionate man who has given his life to his ministry. It is easy to look at the surface of a thing and make assumtions based on gossip and innuendo.

I can personally attest to the fact that God used this man to speak to the very heart of me and help me on my walk as a child of God. First by making me face myself, who I am, what effect my actions have on the world around me and how I can only control one thing in this whole universe....ME.
If I take responsibility for myself and my actions and allow God to work in my life, so I can become the kind of person that I wish others would be. If I tried to leave each person I met better than they were when I found them, if only through a kind word or gesture or a smile as I walked past. If I study, not just the bible, but books about the periods I am reading about, the cultures, the traditions and day to day lives of ancient man, if I study the greek and latin translations and really seek a higher understanding, then I will truely understand that God operates within the laws of nature, that it is not magic that the bible preaches about that it is based on the day to day. Demystify God and you will see him. Further more, Bishop is not a "Money Grabber" as I have seen posted on this site. Bishop never pressures people at church to give money, he says give it if you have it and if you dont that is O.K., he teaches us to be joyful givers, not just at church, but to those in need around us, as the bible says we should be. The money collected at church goes back into the church. Bishop has personal ventures and business' that have helped him to make a good living. And what is wrong with a man being paid a fair wage for a fair days work? Would you work for free? Should he not have the same right as all of us to take part in free commerce? He does so much for his congregation, housing, food, clothing, turkeys every thanksgiving and christmas, toys for children at christmas, education, jobs, training. the list goes on and on. This man has helped countless millions here and abroad. Much more than so many who just sit around pointing out his flaws and shortcomings.

It is easy to sit back and fling mud and spread hurtfull gossip. Making up the rules as you go along. But it is just that.

Why is Bishop Jones single. He preched about it several times. His life as a minister wreaked havok on his first marriage and hurt his ex wife and his children. The hours he had to keep, being called out in the middle of the night to deal with some emergency, the way people can be so mean at church. It is not an easy life for a woman to be married into, being a pastors wife is very difficult. He is also very forthright with the congragation about the part he played in the demise of his marriage. Returning spite for spite, etc. He would be the first one to tell you, do look at me, Im just a man, like everyone else, only God can save you, I struggle with this life just like everyone else. Bishop Jones honors his first wife at his church and is very good to her and his children. I really respect him for that.

In my personal opinion, if you walk into his church on any given day you will meet at least 100 women who will swear with glassy crazed eyes that God told them that they where Bishops wife. It is really scary, they really believe it, all I could think was even if one of you is right 99 of you are wrong. I think it would take one really strong sister to fill that position and I wonder sometimes if any wife of Bishops would be safe from these vipers. Not only good people are attracted to churches and people can sometimes get mixed up on the way. I think that being single is a painful sacrifice that Bishop has made because he knows that any wife he may find would be under terrible attack...justlike he is.

So in closing I say. God bless Bishop Noel Jones, he has been an inspiration to countless many. More than can be said for many who sit around gossiping and flinging mud at him. Not because he is perfect but because he is trying to do something better. So bless you Bishop and remember what Jesus said "If they hate you...remember that they hated me first"

Thanks for you time,
sincerely,
Michelle D. Fraser
Atlanta, GA

[Derrick from Philly]

Kim,
Thanks for taking an interest in the issue, the tone of your response sounds like you're a caring person. We black gay folks don't want the approval of these anti-gay black preachers. We simply want them to stop putting the lives of black gay people (especially the ones who live in the "hoods" across this nation) in danger. When you preach that gay people are "abominations worthy of death" you give religious lunatics and non-religious hoodlums the "OK" to harm gay people. Many Christian ministers don't even bring up the subject of homosexuality in their sermons, they believe it's between God and the individual. We ask, why can't these black ministers concentrate on the teachings of Jesus Christ and leave the foolishness of the Old Testament out of it? Because gay bashing brings in the money, especially from racist white Republicans who'd all be "openly" bigoted members of the Ku Klux Klan if it weren't out of style to be so.
You go through four hundred years of oppression, and then you turn around and do the same to some other vulnerable group. That damn cotton got stuck in some folks' brains.

[KIM]

I came across this web-site and found it very sad. Why is it so imporant that these Pastors be in agreement with homosexuality. If you are comfortable with your sexual orientation then you would not need their approval. You given to much credit to human beings and I don't so much pride in you being gay if your looking for so much approval from the chruch. If your happy with being you just be you!!!!!!!!

[Charlene Moore]

As far as AZUSA STREET - I plan to be there, but not for the AZUSA events (even though our history is the AZUSA STREET/The Pentecostal Movement)- I am a strong believer about everyone having a seat at the table of the Lord. Yes, a hetersexual woman being in favor of same-gender loving marriages, equal working rights, equal living rights, working benefits, buying homes, and having babies - this is the will of God. Being connected to Refuge Ministries in San Francisco, CA - under the leadership of Bishop Yvette A. Flunder is a wonderful experience - I am the musician for the church and I love it and yes we will be in LA this week representing the truth of righteous living - not to flash our sexual choices, (this is a God-event) only to be who we really are and stand tall and be proud to be a child of God. We are coming to have serious church - sending up praises to God - being thankful for his mercy that keeps us everyday. So, for those who have been wondering how we have church and really want to know how God can love us unconditionally - come on to Unity Fellowship Church in Los Angeles on Saturday from 10am to 4pm - I promise you - you will feel the love, the fellowship, and the freedom in the room. When you come - please stop by the organ and let me share with you face to face how much I love this wonderful ministries.

[Nyah Molineaux]

Jasmyne Cannick:

On the immigration issue, I wish you would think differently. I am a child of two foreigners and they have added to our country.

Texas76132:

I want to say that I think your approach to the black mega churches and other mega churches are correct. If you feel that these churches are too homophobic, then leave and find a better church.

There are so many churches out there that teach a progressive message and that teaches the love of Christ instead of the hate of gay people.

The episcopal church is one.

[Laura]

"What you do is create a greater divide and come off looking like a crazed, foolish, black, "I don't want a man" lesbian."

no, she doesn't.

[Laura]

Derrick said, "Do they ever realize that they put black gay people's lives in danger with their anti-gay sermons?"

yes, they do. it's WHY they do it in the first place.

it's not called the "bully pulpit" for nothing...

[Twan86695]

Derrick; I doubt that they do. So many gay people are lost in their uproar. It's a shame one can't go to the church. A better day is coming; I do believe.

[Derrick from philly]

Thanks, Twan:
I get all emotional and start to runnin' my mouth (or fingers on the keyboard), and I forget that their are many good black ministers & religious leaders in the black community. It's just that the ones who are so hypocritical and un-Christian in their hatred for gay people seem to get all the attention. Do they ever realize that they put black gay people's lives in danger with their anti-gay sermons?

[Mel Smith]

Denise, I agree. We must get our own house in order. The challenge will be difficult but I'm confident the job will get done. Amen Twan.

[denise]

Hey Tex...
Amen back at'cha. Your last post hit the nail...yeap.

Mel,
Okay...I understand what you are saying; but why would you settle for being accepted and at the whims of others. Personally, I don't want anyones acceptance... I'd rather be respected...to hell with the rest. Many African Americans used to be like that; but somewhere along the way...this antithetical coddling has made Us weak and wanting...and it is pathetic. Just look to how the coddling of Black males in Our community has resulted.

I am not saying that maybe at sometime in the future We and other entities cannot come to the table and negotiate terms. I'm all for that. But, how can you negotiate anything if you are coming empty handed?

People liking you don't mean that they give a damn about you.

The Majority Gay Community understand that; and as I have mentioned...those in other communities understand that before you can do anything with anyone else; and on equal terms; you have to get your own house in order.

[Mel Smith]

I just want to let you all know that we won't will any battles by isolating ourselves from the larger gay community. I support building our community. But, we must speak the truth; we are more accepted in the larger gay community than in our own communities.

[Twan86695]

Sorry, I didn't mean Mel, I meant thank you texas76132...thanks man for the amen.

[Twan86695]

Thanks for the amen Mel! It is one beautiful day here in Columbia, SC. Now, it's time to go praise the Lord. Of course, I am very proud to say that my Pastor is one of those "heroes"; who is brave enough to respect gay's. I have never heard him preach an anti-gay sermon or bash gays in any form. He was the first Pastor to establish a ministy for AIDs; in my state. He devotes an entire day to the subject and homophobia. Now, I believe he believes that homosexuality is a sin; but if he does believe that; he has never made it known. And he would never judge you or your beliefs or interpretations of the scripture. He will even sit and talk with you and listen to your side of the story and he will pray with you and treat with the dignity and respect as he would any person. I guess, you can say there is don't ask don't tell policy at my church. It's just not an issue. A person sex life is not a concern to my pastor, unless it's an issue for you and he needs to counsel you on it. I respect him, because he had the "dignity" to stay away from the subject of homosexuality when Bush and Rove had everyone black minister jumping on their bang wagon here in SC, my pastor ignored, deleted or never got the "memo". Thank God for respectful, dignified Pastors. They do exist and I believe there are more Pastors in this country like my Pastor. If you are ever in Columbia, SC, visit Brookland Baptist Church, in West Columbia, SC. To everyone, be blessed; continue to pray and know that God will fight our battles and justice will be served. Just know, that we(SGL) are on the right side of justice; the side that God is on; love is on and every compassionate human being there is.

Be blessed!

[Texas76132]

Mel,

I don't have to imagine what it would be like if black folks did not challenge segregation because I'm a black male and experience it everyday. That's black male life 101. You know that. LOL. Anyway, those black generations of yore took care of their business. That's main reason we still have historically black institutions and groups that survive today. The begging to be included folks did not out number the folks who determined their own futures and decided to build something for themselves. I know that is still true today because I see too many people who continue to live that way but wonder why we continue to elect officials who are willing to marginalize themselves and us as a people with their begging mentalities. We keep putting them back in office again and again even when we have the chance to get rid of them. We have blacks who don't believe in begging that run in elections but we still continue to choose the beggars and return them to their jobs. I don't understand the disconnect.

The gay community is a expression that I use to cover several beings. I.E. friends, acquaintances, people and neighborhoods, and so on. Yes, people have the right to express how they feel and we have every right to challenge it when it effects us. No disagreement. When I say that I am tired of people begging to be accepted, I simply mean that we must all determine our own futures and not wait for someone else to come along with an idea and then demand the right to be taken seriously. I see too many people who do that. And yes, it gets old, tiring, and on my nerves. Too many people are reactive instead of proactive and could be more active in driving their futures instead of begging for crumbs and then having to negotiate their destinies with people who may not have their best interest in mind. I'm not trying to be damning, but if you don't make plans for what you want in life, then who will. I saw the Black Enterprise Magazine issue that was mentioned in an earlier post. I don't agree with the pastors politically but I don't begrudge them for having the gumption to get up and determine their futures. Good for them. If the members of those churches used local, state or federal funds to build those neighborhoods, then they have to listen to our input; otherwise, they have successfully built their own compounds disguised as a neighborhoods and should be left alone. Personally, I would never consider living in a neighborhood surrounded the flock of people like T.D. Jakes,Eddie Long or Kirbyjon Caldwell. The smiling faces and backstabbing in those communities would be much more than I could stand.

Twan86695. You got an amen from me. The same for you Denise.

[denise]

sorry about the typos...

[denise]

there are 3 forks in the road for the African American Gay Community; as I see it.

1. We can kowtow to the Black Church; that has done nothing in the African American Community. Yes, there are some Churches that have done some things, but they are few and far between.
A Black Church, mind you, that is full of Gays; and Gay deniers alike. So, they are liars and hypocrites. And they are also thieves....faith based payoffs have gone into the pockets of so-called church leaders.... TD Jakes is the biggest example of this.

2. We can leave the Black Church. Read your bible, there is a passage, that I cannot quote exactly at this time, but it says to get in a closet...which to me, means get to yourself and communicate with your God; and yes, the bible being a contradictory text also says when two or more gets together and pray in his name, etc...
Me, personally, I say instead of paying tithes to hypocritical prostitues...save it, and give it to charity - and to groups in various communities who are really trying to do something positive. I refuse to pay for someone's mercedes and mansion; while the community disenigrates.

3. Black Gays could get more involved with the community. I am not saying that you have to say I am gay and I am doing... I am saying get out there and fight for the community... and stop being pimped by the majority community like the majority African American community is pimped. Instead of putting money and energy in the activities of the White Gay Community and their causes and issues (when they need funds and faces, period); and hoping that they accept you - put that money and energy in the African American Community????

2 and 3 works for me.

African American Leadership is a misnomer period; and I don't know of any African American Gay Leadership. And as recent events have shown...those who are perpetrating some kind of leadership role are nothing more than milly - mouthed pathetic tokens for White Gay Leadership...whose love they crave....

WELFARE CHEESE IS FREE!!!!! WELFARE CHEESE IS FREE!!!!
WELFARE CHEESE IS FREE!!!!! WELFARE CHEESE IS FREE!!!!

Tex, my friend. I agree somewhat is what you stated; but there are those, again, this is a misnomer: Leaders of the Black Church that do blame African American Homosexuals for what has happened to the African American community... I forget names, but how about that lacivious loon who made the statement that
Black women were Lesbians because they made more money than Black men...and then stated some sick shit about Black Lesbians and dildos.... And another crook[ed] Black bastard was on 700 club and said how Homosexuals were killing the African American community.

Yeah, all those Homosexuals having babies and not taking care of them.

You know all those Homosexuals having the communities on lockdown with all their criminal activities.

All those Homosexuals running around raping kids.

All those Homosexuals who collapsed the un - educational system.

All those Homosexuals who have caused disporportionate employment....

And yes, the impotent Black Church is at fault for the rise in anti-gay rhetoric in the African American community... Why?

Why is it that the White Church does not; DOES NOT express such vitriole against the White Gay Community? And when they do, they are made to publicly apologize?

I say because it is in their best interest that the White Community remain whole and together; and the once "more together" Black Community continue to splinter ('cause fact is, We ain't worth about shit, alone and apart - and it does not matter how much you have; or how little; it is a fact).

Alan Keyes disowned his own daughter...while the powers that be; especially the racist and anti - gay ones; have gay children and gay family members; gay friends... and you have ever heard such... and you never will.

"Leaders" in the Black Church are as morally treacherous...and pimped as "Leaders" in the Black Gay Community.... and "Leaders" in the Black Community as a whole.

You see these Whores being pimped like bitches, in every aspects of Our lives; and sadly in Our names.

One last note, the African American Gay Community; devoid of so - called leaders (who? where?; and begin an evolution by not looking for acceptance (not from the White community; and surely not from the Black Church); and focus on empowerment.

Stop being at anyones whims...chart Our own course.

And since Black folk got a self - hate device in their souls... don't believe me, go check out the White Gay Community... walk in China Town. . . go ask the Jews...

Empowerment is the key. More than Politics, More than Numbers.

[Twan86695]

Thanks for the alert. You are correct, these mega, money hungry preachers will use any and every method or means to acquire more wealth and to steal from the pockets of middle class people. I wouldn't give these ministers a penny or half a penny. I believe was as a Gay Community should start supporting and marketing preachers who are supporting us; such as the pastor of Tabernacle Baptist Church in Atlanta, the pastor of Victory Church in the suburbs of Atlanta, the pastor of "The Vision Church" in Atlanta; and many more local pastors who support Gay and Lesbain African-American Men and Women. We should support the pastors that are gay friendly, those that welcome gay people, those that respect Gay people, those that do not sit in judgement. Maybe, there should be articles written about these heroes...rather than the "likes of the Jakes and the Bushes in the country". Can I get amen?

[Mel Smith]

"We have too much talent in the black gay community for us not to do that."

Tex, what do you mean by the black gay community? We don't have no community because we're in the same community with straight folks. They have a right to express how they feel about us and we are allowed to challenge their views. Can you imagine if we as black folks did not challenge segregation or if women did not challenge sexism because "it got on my nerves" to challenge ignorance? Life is not always about going to clubs and partying.

[Texas76132]

Derrick,

I understand were you're coming from, and like you, I don't believe that it's up to the black gay community to make all concessions to the greater black community and keep our "personal business" discreet, nor should we hold our heads down in shame like we've done something wrong while they continue to live their lives as they please no matter how much sin and destruction they cause to themselves and the people around them. Under no circumstances should we cow tow to them for any reason, but, having said that, I do believe that if a person goes into a private non-governmental entity such as a church on their own accord, they are obligated to follow protocol if they wish to remain a member of that organization, especially when they knew how those people were before they walked through the door. Some of these churches may be despicable, but they still are entitled to their own clique. They do have the law on their side because the government has ruled again and again that they cannot and will not help you in these situations. The law will only help you once these organizations begin to accept government funds. Then it's a whole new ball game. Thank God for people like Harriet Tubman and the many courageous people of the Civil Rights eras of the 1950's and 1960's. They won that war years ago. We just need to take advantage of those rights and defend them vigorously.

There are legitimate fights that we should have with churches on several fronts. Then there is putting yourself unnecessarily in harms way mentally or physically for no good reason. Fight them on the issues you deem important but don't go inside the lion's den and put yourself in harms way unless you can take it. Because, right or wrong, that is their space and they are entitled to it. For me, it's like walking down the middle of a dark alley and in the worst part of town. I have the right to do it , but if I do, I shouldn't be surprised when the obvious happens.

As you said, this is the 21st century. I'm not about to get on their plantations either. That's why I believe that we would move forward allot quicker if we concentrated on building strong communities and not put ourselves in the position to having to beg anyone. We have too much talent in the black gay community for us not to do that. And besides, this constant begging we are doing to be accepted by people who don't want anything to do with us is beginning to get on my nerves. I just didn't articulate it as much as I should have.

[Mel Smith]

I wrote the response to Nebankh.